A blog dedicated to the New York Mets with some other baseball thrown in.

Thursday, January 31, 2008

Damaged Goods/Viva Johan!!!

"The Twins are going to know him better than anybody," an evaluator in the AL said Tuesday night. "It's not that they think he's hurt, but maybe they're seeing signs (of decline) in him, and figure it's better to make the move now."

A clear option would've been for the Twins to hang onto Santana and try to win in '08. "But there was a reason why they made the decision to move him now," said the evaluator. "They're smart people over there. It makes you think … "

Santana injured? That deserves one of these. Regardless, let us take a look at Santana and his incredibly soon-to-be exploding arm.

There are various tools we can use to try and predict a pitcher's future performance.

1) DiPS is pretty good and may it correlate more with next year's ERA than the true ERA.
2) GB/FB ratio is also useful.
3) K/9, K/BB ratio, and HR/9 rate are pretty widely accepted as well.

First, his DiPS ERA was 3.65 in 2007. That compares favorably with many other top pitchers and is not far off his regular ERA. Also, we know he had a bad year so it was understandable that his DiPS ERA was up from 3.05 the previous year. Of course this is still a negative trend, but nothing out of the ordinary in my eyes and no other peripheral stat jumped out in correlation with the jump in ERA. Besides, it was still pretty damn good and if he had a DiPS ERA of 4.50, I might have one tiny bead of sweat as it would have suggested he performed far worse than his numbers would have seemed to indicated.

Second, his GB/FB ratio over the last six seasons was .70, .58, .93, .91, 1.06, and .92. Basically, he has been right were he has been since 2004. Yes, more balls went over the fence, but this basically tells me not much changed in 2007 it was more freakish than anything.

Lastly, his K/9 was 11.38, 9.61, 10.46, 9.25, 9.44, and 9.66 since 2002. His K/BB was 2.80, 3.60, 4.91, 5.29, 5.21, and 4.52 since 2002. His HR/9 has been .58, .97, .95, .85. .92, and 1.35 since 2002.

The only thing that jumps out at us is the HR/9 in 2007, but we knew it would be high. His career average is .99 and he eclipsed that by 36%. However, his K/9 and his and K/BB were above his career average.

Now we'll just take a quick peak at 2007 a bit closer. In the first half he had a 7.07 H/9, 9.30 K/9, 2.23 K/BB, 1.26 HR/9, and a 0.215 BAA. In the second half he had a 8.07 H/9 (Beckett had a 8.48 H/9 all year and Sabathia had a 8.89 H/9 all year), 10.10 K/9, 2.02 K/BB, 1.47 HR/9, and a .236 BAA.

In September when he had that last string of horrific starts, he had a 7.84 H/9, 10.16 K/9, 3.19 K/BB, 1.16 HR/9, and a .229 BAA. So while he did tail off at the end, his peripheral numbers should give everyone some confidence that his 'stuff' was still good.

If there is anything out of all of the above to suggest decline or worrisome problem over homer happy anomaly, I am all ears. The guy was still ridiculously valuable last year and his peripherals really were rather consistent throughout the year and his 2007 was pretty much in line with 2004, 2005, and 2006, which did net him two Cy Young Awards. If you could show me a huge jump in GB/FB ratio in tandem with the high homer rate, I would say you had something resembling an argument. However, it just seems ten extra balls found their way over the wall, but luckily, I think Johan is good enough to adjust. Also, It never hurts to get some good old fashioned scouting in conjunction with numbers.

“He threw the ball over the plate and didn’t make pitches,” the evaluator said. “They were out of the race; maybe he was just trying to throw it over. He didn’t walk many guys and he got beat with some early-count fastballs. If they’d been in the race at all, maybe he’d have been a little more selective. But he was healthy. He was still throwing hard, still pitching deep into games.”

Instead of some crazy injury theories, let me for a second cook up some crazy scheme. Some players do not like getting traded mid-year. Carlos Delgado is a prime example and conveniently plays on the New York Metropolitans. Before he left for free agency, the Blue Jays wanted to trade him to a contender. You know what? He declined and exercised his no trade clause.

The Twins were in the know alright. They knew that Johan said trade me now or watch me walk for two draft picks and you can forget about signing me no matter how much you throw at me. The Twins leverage here was at an all time low with only one serious team involved and Johan's desire to leave ASAP. Have we all forgotten this?

These were Johan Santana's words Tuesday after the non-waiver trade deadline passed without another trade: "I'm not surprised. That's exactly how they are. That's why we're never going to go beyond where we've gone."

The Twins acquired two minor league prospects for Castillo, saved $2 million in payroll and did nothing to bolster this year's chances.

"It's not just about hope," Santana said. "In a realistic world, you have to really make it happen and go for it.

"You always talk about future, future. ... But if you only worry about the future, then I guess a lot of us won't be part of it," Santana said.

The two-time Cy Young Award winner wasn't smiling.

"Why waste time when you're talking about something that's always going to be like that? It's never going to be beyond this point. It doesn't make any sense for me to be here, you know?"

Torii Hunter will be a free agent at season's end. Santana and Joe Nathan will be free agents after 2008. Asked what message Ryan's latest decisions had sent to that trio, Santana continued firing.

"I've been here for eight years, and I've seen a lot of those kind of things," he said. "I've seen a lot of those guys [like Castillo] come in and leave. [The decision makers] don't care. They always talk about caring about it; I don't think they care.

"Because if you're always talking about having young players — that's the philosophy the team has, and I respect all that — but it's been proven that it's not enough to go all the way to the World Series."

Explosive. My response to those who think the Twins knew about some injury or that Johan is in decline? Wrong. This is simply a guy who seemingly wanted to be on the Mets and in the National League and the everything worked out in his favor.

* * *

  • Keith Law is the only the guy who I really think did a good job covering this trade.

    In the abstract, it's hard to accept dealing your marquee player and top trading asset without getting your partner's top young player in return, and that's what the Twins did. They did get back significant economic value in four young players, each of whom has under one year of big-league service and two of whom aren't even on the Mets' 40-man roster yet, so the Twins will have each of them under control for six full years of service. That return in exchange for just one year of Santana's services is reasonable. But premium players should fetch premium prices, because there's value to a club in having so much production coming from a single roster spot. And in this case, Minnesota GM Bill Smith did not get a premium prospect in return.

    Of course you would like to get premium players back who are ready to be stars now like Hughes or Jones, but maybe they should have dealt him before the 2007 season. They did not and were in this position. This is a topsy turvy time we live in where youth is gaining value. Of course we can argue whether or not youth is gaining too much value, but they are indeed gaining value.

    If people give up youth, they want youth and value back. Not one year and immense risk. If the Twins wanted the Mets to give up Fernando too, then the Mets would have needed another few years under market value to mitigate their risk.

  • Actually, I lied above. Joe Posnanski had probably the best piece of all on the trade. It really gives you some valuable insight and basically, no one is right or wrong. There are valid reasons to be on either side of the fence or straddling it.

  • Some Yankee fan called into WFAN yesterday and said Johan is not even the best pitcher in the league. Josh Beckett is. Right, even if I conceded to that madness, then he is the second best. What is the point?

  • I heart Time Marchman and his stoic looking picture.

    As if that piece was not enough, he drops this one on us.

    To put the point differently, we can compare what the Mets would look like with and without Santana, using Dan Szymborski's excellent ZiPS projections, which are available at baseballthinkfactory.org. According to Szymborski's numbers, Pedro Martinez, John Maine, Oliver Perez, Hernandez, and Pelfrey project to pitch 796 innings this year, with a 4.10 earned run average. Swap Pelfrey out for Santana, and the rotation looks good for a 3.69 ERA in 880 innings.

    It is nice to have someone NOT try and pee on our picnic.

    The glow won't fade for weeks.

  • I still think the Indians could retain CC as long as they do not add a no trade clause, but who knows. It is a lot of cash and Fausto may persuade them to roll the dice and try their luck without him.

  • Fun Santana facts of the day.
    • In 2007, he struck out 62 lefties while allowing 39 hits. In fact, he struck out more righties than he allowed hits as well in his off year.
    • The majority of big leaguers are righties. Over the last three years, Santana has held righties to a .213/.251/.358 line. Don't worry, I soiled my underwear as well.
    • Johan Santana is not Barry Zito.
    • Johan was selected by the Florida Marlins from Houston in the 1999 Rule 5 draft and then traded to the Minnesota Twins for minor leaguer Jared Camp. Camp never threw a pitch in the big leagues....Ooooops.
  • CC is down for extra drug testing.

  • There may be other teams jumping into the mix for Bedard.

  • The Mets picked up Ruddy Lugo, who is incidentally Benny's best friend. Shit, meet wall. Wall, meet shit. Hopefully something sticks.

  • Inflammatory? Perhaps. But nice to read. Also, a A+++ comment surfaced here.

    Strawdoc Jan 30, 2008 8:20:07 PM Report Offensive Post
    It is so funny -- the Daily News runs this whimsical story, complete with provocative headline, to stir up yanks fans. And sure enough, the usual nitwits like libertytwerp are pounding their keyboards in indignant frustration (compounded, in libertytoy's case, by his apparently unsuccessful effort earlier today to find a 13-year-old girl). What upsets them is that with this deal, the Mets are clearly the best in the city (remember, we can't look at the yanks' PEDs-tainted stats. to assess their roster). Not to mention best in the National League.

  • Interesting.

    Pelfrey never a factor: It turns out there was no chance that Mike Pelfrey would be included in the package for Santana. The Twins were interested in Pelfrey as a pitcher, but not as an expense. The agreement that Pelfrey's agent, Scott Boras, negotiated with the Mets when they selected Pelfrey in the first round of the 2005 First-Year Player Draft established the pitcher's salaries for four seasons.

    Pelfrey is to earn at least $1 million this year, whether he's in the big leagues or not. And the Twins, always cost-conscious, don't want to pay anyone that kind of salary for Minor League work.

    I cannot say I am unhappy about that at all.

  • When Mike Carp is in your top five, it is safe to assume you have the worst system in the big leagues.

    New York Mets

    1. Fernando Martinez, cf
    2. Brant Rustich, rhp
    3. Nathan Vineyard, lhp
    4. Jon Niese, lhp
    5. Mike Carp, 1b

    As for the Twins, they do not look so bad.


    1. Carlos Gomez, cf
    2. Deolis Guerra, rhp
    3. Tyler Robertson, lhp
    4. Wilson Ramos, c
    5. Philip Humber, rhp

    Of course I think Mulvey is better than Humber, but it seems they did well if they added their #1 and #2 prospects in the deal. Sickels on the other hand is not as high on Gomez.

    1. Deolis Guerra, RHP, Grade B+
    2. Tyler Robertson, LHP, Grade B+
    3. Kevin Mulvey, RHP, Grade B
    4. Anthony Swarzak, RHP, Grade B
    5. Ben Revere, OF, Grade B
    6. Carlos Gomez, OF, Grade B
    7. Glen Perkins, LHP, Grade B-
    8. Phil Humber, RHP, Grade B-

    Jim Callis is also very low on Carlos Gomez citing that Carlos Beltran is his ceiling, but he does not see that happening. The fact is, Gomez is just one of those guys who you love or hate. He has all the talent in the world, but obviously the odds are stacked against him.

    However, he did make strides in the minors increasing his walk rate and slugging over the years. In '07, he for the most part lost a year of development time. Instead of playing everyday at AAA, he was in the bigs way before he should have been and then broke his hand. I think the kid will develop into something very good, but he still needs development time and last year was not a good year for him in many facets.

  • I still find it amusing how people feel the need to rain on the Met parade. However, when you try and say that Schneider is a downgrade from LoDuca you lose me. Construct a meaningful argument and I might listen. But baseless claims get you no where.

    If this was 1902 and we were looking solely at batting average, maybe Schneider is a downgrade. But this is 2007 and Schneider is at worst a sideways move offensively with a pretty good chance to be an upgrade. Compound that with LoDuca's injury and this one is a no brainer.

  • .....and finally, I leave you with this.

    "Santana's so good, though, he'll do so much for them," the GM said. "There's not much chance of buyer's regret."
  • Labels: ,


    Anonymous Danny said...

    Love the stuff on Johan. I find it laughable that some people are claiming that he is on the downside of his career.

    I will disagree fairly strongly that the Mets have the worst minor league system in baseball. There are a bunch of systems that don't have an impact player like Fernando Martinez in it. Fernando alone ensures that the Mets should not be ranked the worst. Carp is a pretty horrible #5 overall prospect, though. Maybe they are like 30th out of 32 teams...

    Having said all of that, the Mets need some guys to make The Leap this year in their farm system...

    **puts on optimistic Mets fan hat**

    Wilmer Flores is their best international signing of 2007, so hopefully he does some good 17 year-old things this year and at least shows promise. The Mets have had a year to work with Francisco Pena, so maybe he makes a mini-leap as an 18 year-old. If Brahiam Maldonado improves his plate discipline and keeps his power at St. Lucie this year, he rockets up the prospect rankings. I really like Rustich, Moviel and Vineyard as young arms with promise. Niese was damn good in the second half last year at St. Lucie. Maybe Parnell figures out how to throw strikes this year. And there is always the high potential and underachieving Lagares/Veloz/Pellot group.

    **takes off optimistic Mets fan hat**

    Gosh, we need a lot to go right!

    9:50 AM

    Blogger AE said...

    1. as said above, awesome santana coverage.

    2. keith law's article is the reason why no one else in the "biz" needs to write another article about the trade. buster olneys needs to shut the fuck up.

    3. my initial projections have the mets in the 89-96 wins range...AWESOME.

    4. lo duca hit .272/.311/.378 - .689 ops last year. i have schneider tagged to hit .249/.330/.353 - .683 OPS. the miniscule loss of .06 in ops will be made up with better defense and a better overall clubhouse citizen. win mets...

    5. go back to number 3 and get excited.

    6. repeat 5.

    10:04 AM

    Anonymous benny blanco from da bronx said...

    I fucking love that prarie dog man, I knew it was coming and I laughed before I even click the link. Good stuff.

    Funny... this quote is just funny.
    "The Twins are going to know him better than anybody," an evaluator in the AL said Tuesday night. "It's not that they think he's hurt, but maybe they're seeing signs (of decline) in him, and figure it's better to make the move now."

    Hurt? He was soo hurt they offered him a $90 million extension over 5 years I think. I guess that proposal for an extension also proves the Twins saw a decline.
    And the weirdest part of the quote is that the Twins "figure its better to make the move now"? REALLY? As opposed to when? Next season-- oh wait!
    Whatever, it's just weird how Johan goes from best pitcher in the game to... "maybe he's hurt! no wait he's declining! he sucks!"

    Beautiful quote by Torii Hunter on USA Today:
    “The Mets are not only getting a Cy Young winner, but an absolute bulldog who’s great in the clubhouse. He’s going to dominate that league. They’re going to absolutely love him in New York…I know he’s happy, too, because he really wanted to go to the Mets. He’s always wanted to swing the wood. He can hit…So I don’t know who’s happier, Johan, the Mets, or everyone in the American League because they don’t have to face him anymore.”

    Tim Marchman really put it in perspective when he mentions Maddux joining the Braves at age 27 and Pedro at age 26, I mean, Johan's already older, he's going into his age 29 season, but that's still valuable.

    I mentioned it the other day but I gotta mention it again. Just remember the game he pitched against the Mets last summer, his 4 hit complete game shutout, while throwing only 90 pitches. That is a masterpiece. A couple of weeks ago, I saw it on MLB.TV and he didn't even have his best stuff. He was throwing in the low 90's and still getting alot of weak grounders and lazy flyballs. He only got one strikeout if I remember correctly.
    I <3 Johan Santana

    C.C. Sabathia does it on hotdogs & beer

    Hey Ruddy Lugo has good stuff!
    mid 90's with a nice slider, he just has to control it.
    And c'mon he's a local guy! Ruddy=Rudy!
    On the topic of Ruddy Lugo, somebody at Metsblog had one of the funniest comments ever, he says "Does he intentionally blow leads in order to get wins??
    That shit was funny.

    I'm doing quite alot of quoting today...
    Essentially, the Mets are front-ending their pitching staff — Santana for the departed Tom Glavine. That upgrade does not necessarily make them a better
    Ehh? I can't even put into words a reaction to this.

    In other news, I REALLY admire Johan's goatee, its soo well trimmed. I wish I had a barber to constantly shape me up. You know what, if there's one thing about ball players its that they're usually fresh when it comes to thier hair, I'm soo jealous. I just can't go around spending $20 every week on haircuts.

    10:08 AM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    Danny, if the Yankees got him, you would not see a peep about the downside of his career...or the Red Sox for that matter.

    However, it is the Mets...so he's done.

    The Mets have three or four B or better prospects YIKES! I think Moviel is B type guy as well, but you can certainly make the argument they are the worst. I have not given it a quick look.

    But yes, I guess Fernando DOES get them the 30th spot.

    I sent Sickels about 30 questions and those guys were all in it. Hopefully he gets me back answers to all of them!!!!

    AE...all Santana all the time. I am very excited.

    I love Law. I think he is objective and I like that he is opinionated. He at least as some reasoning to back it all up.

    And can we just give Marchman and Dayn Perry (yes, even him) their due for trying to add some advanced statistics into their writing? Really good stuff.

    Did you get my email? I loved the piece on your site. If you could write up some good projection article I would love to either link to it or post it here. I'm tooooo lazy to put it all together.

    You have to like the fact Schneider takes a pitch as well. Let him get walked all day in that 8th slot.

    I think the Mets have an outside shot at 100. Really, if Maine and Perez continue down the same road and Pedro is at least league average, things are pretty tight.

    A lot of ifs, but look at the team that is out there opening day. Above average production EVERYWHERE except 2b. Castro/Brian should be able to together an above average season from the catcher spot.

    I fucking love that prarie dog man, I knew it was coming and I laughed before I even click the link. Good stuff.

    I love it as well.

    Benny...great stuff. You just gave me plenty for my post tomorrow.

    And we get to watch him 30+ times a year. Fucking A!

    I always agree with the bullpen guys that can throw hard. I kid partially, but still. You have to admit his shot of making the team are loooooow.

    I just can't go around spending $20 every week on haircuts.

    Date a hairstylist. Problem solved. If you have any other problems, feel free to ask me. I have answers.

    10:42 AM

    Anonymous Dep said...

    I love this posting every day shit! Nothing makes me happier at work than seeing a new post on this site! yeehaw!

    I havent even read it yet. I just wanted to express that! :)

    10:52 AM

    Blogger AE said...

    mike, i didn't get the email. i'm not sure which address you have but try angryeverett@yahoo.com.

    as far as projections i have a spreadsheet going but it's too big to post as is and it looks kind of whatevs right now. once i get the pecota #s i'm going to do it up right and get it out there.

    anyway, just an initial look at the numbers suggests the offense will be the same as the one that scored 804 runs last year. the defense/pitching combo is projected to yield approx 690 runs - 60 runs better than last years 750. 60 runs = 6 wins. 88+6=94 wins. math is easy....

    the thing that catches my eye about the pitching is the fact that you add santana into the mix, more innings from pedro, and possibly a more mature pelfrey as a spot starter and you got yourself an awesome frontline that will compete well against arizona and san diego as best starting rotation in the nl.

    i like what i see. i can't lie. omar gets somewhat of a reprieve for now on the lastings deal....

    11:09 AM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    Dep...most people don't read anyway so do not feel bad.

    AE, I used the one on the top right of the site.

    690 runs!!!! Holy shit that would amazing. Amazing.

    11:13 AM

    Blogger AE said...

    weird. it wasn't in the inbox. if you want to resend use angryeverett at yahoo dot com.

    as for 690 runs allowed, only 2 teams in the nl allowed that few last year and only 1 team allowed that few the year before. i'd say the mets have a good chance to be one of the best pitching/defensive units in the league, if not the best.

    and as much as chicks dig the long ball, i'm loving the other side of the ball. run prevention is a beautiful thing!

    11:57 AM

    Anonymous Anonymous said...

    Time Marchman... very Dickens.

    'Date a hairstylist. Problem solved. If you have any other problems, feel free to ask me. I have answers.'

    Or use a bowl or a [snicker] flowbee.

    If they don't sign Santana, i'll kill Minaya... and I suspect i'll have to get in line.


    1:04 PM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    Thanks AE...I now have my post for tomorrow. Chicks Dig Run Protection....

    Emad, you suspect right. There will be a loooooong line. I just hope they do not try and go cheap on the draft because they dished out so much cash on Johan.

    Flowbee? Can you still buy those? If so, I'm in.

    1:13 PM

    Blogger metsfanincincy said...

    "Essentially, the Mets are front-ending their pitching staff — Santana for the departed Tom Glavine. That upgrade does not necessarily make them a better."

    Well, I guess that's accurate if by the front-end he means 1 - 4. WTF?

    I was starting to buy the story that the Mets got Johan for nothing even though I knew better (there is something satisfying about the Mets fleecing someone instead of getting fleeced), but after seeing that the players they sent all ended up in the Twin's top 10 you have to admit that the Twins got some value. The way the press was downplaying the Met's farm system you'd think that their top prospects wouldn't rank near the top in anyone else's system.

    I really think the Mets will have a good draft. Omar has already laid the groundwork for ignoring the slot thing. Things can change fast. It wasn't long ago that the Yankees farm system was universally seen as a joke.

    1:20 PM

    Anonymous Anonymous said...

    Sure, but you have to be unconcerned with your appearance to use one.



    1:20 PM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    You would think the Mets guys were scrubs, but they weren't. I'm not going to say it was the best, but it has value.

    I love how no one mentions ceilings in their pieces. Just bottoms when it came to them and all the negtives. None of the positives. Good stuff.

    Sure, but you have to be unconcerned with your appearance to use one.

    How so? I buzz my head with a #2 so the Flowbee seems to be EXACTLY what I need.

    Right on. I forgot. I cannot wait until Omar drafts another 2nd tier college closer.

    1:24 PM

    Anonymous Anonymous said...

    why do you say if pedro is league average? his numbers were good last year -- except whip and baa. and i assume he's gotten stronger. but i haven't read anything about him this winter. what's his outlook?


    2:14 PM

    Blogger Itsmetsforme said...

    re: johans trimmed facial hair.

    the ONLY downside i can detect about this deal is that Johan's growth reminds me too much of mike hamptons. never trusted that guy.

    2:23 PM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    Jake...I was using a low end projection there. Will Carroll says everything is hunky dory. I am VERY optimistic we see a low 3's from Pedro with a 9.00 K/9.

    Good stuff all around.

    Yeah, he looks like Hampton physically down to the goatee. But let us now forget, Hampton was really, really, really good. He ruined his career going to CO.

    2:38 PM

    Blogger Rickey Henderson said...

    Baseball Jesus doesn't get hurt. Baseball Jesus inflicts hurt on others.

    3:15 PM

    Anonymous Anonymous said...

    Almost forgot.

    Lost is back tonight.

    Mike, get the Lily pics ready.

    - Nokes

    3:23 PM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    LOST is indeed back. There are so many good things going on I do not need to drink to make any pain going away.

    This 'happiness' thing was totally not overrated.

    Johan has been spotted walking on water...

    3:31 PM

    Anonymous benny said...

    Johan Santana's goatee kills Mike Hampton's goatee any day of the week. Hampton's is all over the place, he probably takes care of it himself.
    Johan's goatee is done by a professional and borders on being a work of art.

    Jorge Julio on the Indians on a minor league contract, my goodness, how the mighty have fallen!
    That guy is so agravating. Fucking throwing 98 mph with movement and he still sucks balls.

    Jayson Stark says Omar might sign Kyle Lohse. Puts El Duque in the bullpen. That is balls deep.

    4:06 PM

    Anonymous DG said...

    I would have no problem signing Lohse over Livan as Lohse has better stuff even if he hasn't shown as yet the ability to master it. With El Duque, Pedro and possibly Ollie (nooooooo!) coming off the staff next yaer, he's a decent person to offer three years depending on the price of course. I like the idea of the Mets signing a fifth starter over El Duque and leaving Pelf in NewOrgylands for the year. But then again, it is not a needed expenditure at all.

    Does anyone know when Ollie's arb date is?

    And Mike you didn't even run with my Cheeseburger in a Can?

    5:14 PM

    Anonymous Anonymous said...

    'That is balls deep.'

    IDK, I just never understood that phrase outside of the context of a porno.

    I'm pretty sure there's a few rap songs that include it... can't recall any off hand. You won't find it in any Special Ed or KRS.


    5:39 PM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    Balls deep? You are all in baby. What's not to get?

    5:48 PM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    Johan is serious about his metrosexuality. He'll fit in perfect here.

    Lohse is interesting. That would give them seven starters, whic is nice.

    However, I would hate to see Pelf buried, but I guess that is OK if he works on things in AAA. No doubt he will make an appearance anyway, but whatever.

    It also seems to signal Perez or Pedro are 100% gone in 2009.

    Any change they give Perez a four year extension including buying out his last year? Would Boras ever do that? I'm thinking that is an emphatic no.

    Cheeseburger in a can? Sounds delicious. Does this exist?

    5:52 PM

    Anonymous DG said...

    I sent you the link!

    5:59 PM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    Oh, I saw the link now and it will be posted tomorrow. It looks delicious, but I remain skeptical it actually looks like that out of the can.

    Although, if they could put a human being on the moon, I suppose they can make a nice looking cheeseburger out of the can.

    6:16 PM

    Anonymous Anonymous said...

    'You are all in baby.'

    Clearer metaphor, but, that's not the first emotion-feeling I get.

    ''Jenna Haze is awesome. She just went balls deep on that guy. If my girl could unhinge her jaw like Jenna, that would rule.''

    'What's not to get?'

    Everything. You had to use a gambling analogy to explain it.

    'Johan is serious about his metrosexuality.'

    Fuck that fag. Let the Yankees have him.


    6:29 PM

    Anonymous Dep said...

    ha, you posted on the geek today.

    you sly dog.

    i'm dptydwg420 on there. Dep for short!

    Work was busy today! boo!


    6:35 PM

    Anonymous Anonymous said...

    'ha, you posted on the geek today.'



    6:38 PM

    Anonymous Dep said...

    What ever made you think i was talking to you and not the creator of the blog?????

    6:40 PM

    Anonymous Anonymous said...

    said the douche


    6:42 PM

    Anonymous Dep said...

    that's not very nice.

    6:46 PM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    Emad is very jaded. He is voice of dissention around here and it is accepted.

    I do however think he is coming around and will crack a smile one of these days....the Mets are going to be really, really, really good.

    I did post over there today. I wanted to jump in the fray. I've been very unproductive these days reading as much as I can about Johan.

    6:56 PM

    Anonymous Anonymous said...

    ''What ever made you think i was talking to you and not the creator of the blog?????''

    Neither was that -- and its passive-agressive attitude just SCREAMS retarded Metsgeek douche.


    6:56 PM

    Anonymous Anonymous said...

    'I do however think he is coming around and will crack a smile one of these days.'

    We Russians aren't all smiles und sunshine.


    7:00 PM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    Smiles and sunshine you are not.

    Also, dep is one of the good ones from over there. Everyone play nice in the sandbox.

    7:05 PM

    Anonymous Dep said...


    hey man I'm sorry if i was passive agressive douchey to you. you really think I deserved to be called a douche for that, so be it. i can take it.

    There was really nothing in there to make you think i was talking to you so i was curious what made you think that, if I phrased it in an uppity way, my bad.

    But i'm sure you'll take what i wrote here and with your uber-brain turn it on me in some way.

    so go ahead, make me regret saying I'm sorry.

    7:06 PM

    Anonymous Dep said...

    Mike, I liked what you wrote about Pelfrey over on the geek.

    so few ppl on there have any faith in the kid anymore. its bad. like 10% tops.

    I hope he makes ppl regret losing faith in 2008.

    I want him starting out in AAA and kicking ass since he's never dominated that level and all ready n waiting when Duque's arm falls off.

    yes I still say hold Duque in the rotation. dude's too good in there to boot. even if he's only gonna give us 150 innings, so be it. they are quality.

    7:09 PM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    If you like that you'll love Monday's Pelfrey post. Of course I have nothing to actually support my optimism statistically, but I am feeling good about him.

    I was really, really, really not looking forward to this season. I was lukewarm about anything Mets, hence the sparse posting. Now I am all 'smiles and sunshine' these days. Amazing what a two time Cy Young Award winner on the right side of 30 will do for a fanbase.

    7:13 PM

    Anonymous Dep said...

    Johan wants $160M; mets are at $140M right now_Per Heyman

    7:14 PM

    Anonymous Anonymous said...

    I'd say just let it drift, dep.

    'so few ppl on there have any faith in the kid anymore. its bad. like 10% tops.'

    Mike is defending Pelfrey now...

    Um, wasn't there a time not so long ago where you really hated Pelfrey and his body language, et cetera?

    Your mind changed, apparently.

    As Homer would say, explain why.


    7:16 PM

    Anonymous Dep said...

    yea, its amazing how one WOW move can turn an offseason from horrible to amazing.

    its really amazing how johan fell into our laps.

    A perfect storm of good things had to happen and they did.

    Imagine the Red Sox didnt win the bidding for D-Mat???? they probly would not have blinked at the budgetary cost for Johan. Maybe since Beckett will be up again in a bit, but who knows.

    So many things had to break right and they did, and Omar had the balls n brains to ride the wave and hold Fernando and it worked out.

    Now lets just sign the man and go to work.

    I still say sign Mench or somebody, I wouldnt mind another righty OF type in the mix

    I look forward to monday's pelfrey post. I have off that day too. swell! I take off every monday after the super bowl for 6-7 years now LOL I like it.

    7:17 PM

    Anonymous Dep said...

    consider it drifted emad. no worries.

    I just hope you dont view me thru some generalization you have for all of metsgeek. we're not all the same.

    7:19 PM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    I will explain why on Monday, but yes, I was down on him. People are dynamic animals and tend to do such things.

    I will say that the kid showed me a little something at the end of the season. If you go back and read some older posts, I am sure that you will see my viewpoints drift from positive (before the season) to negative (during the season) to positive (in early Aug/Sept.).

    RE: Johan...I think the Mets are being fair, no? If this ends in a bad way I might kill someone.

    Didn't a Met fan kill his mother last year after a tough loss?

    7:20 PM

    Blogger mr. met said...


    I'd imagine this will be a common occurrence in the wake of this thing blowing up.

    7:21 PM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    Mench would be nice. We need some pop off the bench, but would that mean Gotay is the odd man out?

    7:23 PM

    Anonymous Dep said...

    oh man, I remember hearing about that story last year but I had forgotten.

    jeebus, that's a bad one. Many people's lives will be in danger if this falls thru.

    I refuse to even entertain that notion seriously at this time, maybe late friday (post 5pm) I will with a bottle of scotch. but not till then.

    Can Johan extend the window or do the twins have to? do you know (or anyone) how that works?

    re: Mench, yea that would take Gotay's spot which we cant do. he has to make the team I figure. we have no one else that can back up 3rd or SS at an even remotely adequate level.

    I worry about someone like Easley sucking it up and it would be nice to have a mench hiding in AAA to help out. But i guess that's what Angel Pagan is for or something. I didnt check he's righty, but i think he is.

    7:26 PM

    Anonymous Anonymous said...

    'People are dynamic animals and tend to do such things.'

    Yes. They are called flip-floppers. The worst kind wear socks.

    Looking forward to Monday, but please, no more talk about ubermench.


    7:28 PM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    I do not wear socks with flip flops.

    Ubermench? Every team could use a guy with 8 inch hat size. Every team.

    Yes, they can extend the window. That is not really a problem. However, if they cannot get it done by 5:00 tomorrow, will they really get it done?

    I like Gotay more than I should, but his swing is for real. Compact and just rips line drives. I see him as a super sub this year for the Mets and hopefully he can get some ABs.

    7:35 PM

    Anonymous Anonymous said...

    'Ubermench? Every team could use a guy with 8 inch hat size. Every team.'

    The gravitational pull of his head results in fewer HR for the opposition.

    Um, that spot is going to Valentin. Gotay ain't getting sheeeeeeet.



    7:40 PM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    Valentin has a minor league contract, no?

    Thankfully Willie does not make the roster. If he makes the team over Gotay that would be utterly ridiculous.

    See? Mench's head would prevent many, many, many homers.

    Burrell is up? Put him in left field. Howard? Shift him to right field. Nothing short of brilliant if you ask me.

    I'm out...good night.

    7:48 PM

    Anonymous Two-By-Four said...

    I find myself somewhat perplexed at some of the media induced hysteria circling the Mets acquisition of Santana. It appears these people would have been happy if the Mets had not only surrendered the four moving on but would have included FM and Heilman. Some of the early articles went so far as to say those 6 were not even fair compensation for Santana. For the Twins it was not getting equal value for Sanatana but rather what was the best they could do given all the other parameters surrounding the deal. Since the Mets are one of the few teams that can afford to sign Santana to a lucrative long term deal it is an outstanding trade for the Mets. The Mets gave up much less than I thought they would and Omar must be congratulated for his card playing here. Not including Doc Gooden whose star went super-nova so early in his career Santana will be the 2nd best pitcher in Mets history (yes, Seaver was better) and while the Mets prospects going to the Twins are good I don’t see a Tom Seaver or Willie Mays potential prospect in the group. Well done Omar and now Mr. Wilpon complete the deal.

    12:32 AM

    Blogger Itsmetsforme said...

    I hate to comment on Lost around here cause I'm a tough guy not some soap watchin sissy. But I'm lost with that plot. Jack would have shot Locke. Fine by me, but I'd think being rescued would be the priority. More chicks need to be kissing like the other chick did in that movie Gia. Stuck on that island for all that time and no one wanted to experiment with their sexuality? Not realistic.

    Johan will sign today, but crossin our fingers anyhow, just cause we're metsfans and we know how it goes.

    Then we can hyperventilate about the physicals for the weekend.

    3:33 AM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    Stuck on that island for all that time and no one wanted to experiment with their sexuality?

    What about bathing habits? The odor around that island must not be pleasant and a bit of a turn-off.

    I will admit the plot has gone awry. I give it a pass since it was episode #1, but it was marginal.

    Now I do like the working backwards in time and forward as well so we'll meet at the one point that explains everything, but it just seems like the writers are flying off the handle.

    I still have no idea why the 'others' were the original inhabitants. I would like to know that one.

    10:29 AM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    2x4...but did they not get equal value for what they were selling?

    I think they did. That being said, Omar was outstanding and it would be interesting to compare and contrast Seaver vs. Santana.

    10:30 AM

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