A blog dedicated to the New York Mets with some other baseball thrown in.

Thursday, February 07, 2008

Futile But Fun

Dayn Perry goes over his list of the worst starting players by position.

To be honest, I thought I would see Brian Schneider on this list unjustly. There are worse and sure enough, Mr. Perry agreed.

C — Jason Kendall, Brewers
Kendall narrowly edges out Paul Lo Duca for worst catcher. In 2007, Kendall "hit" .242 AVG/.301 OBP/.309 SLG and tallied only 24 extra-base hits in 514 plate appearances. Unless you're a pitcher, those power numbers are patently unacceptable. That's to say nothing of Kendall's poor throwing arm behind the plate. At age 33, he doesn't figure to improve going forward.

LoDuca was the other choice and it is funny because people are still harping on him being an offensively superior player than Brian. Right. Perry did get it right here as Kendall actually added negative value.

One of the bigger mysteries in the universe is why GMs prefer guys like him to the Geovany Soto's of the world. One is a known quantity whose name you have heard, but at least the Soto-type players represent hope, upside, and possibly positive value.

1B — Kevin Millar, Orioles
Last season, the 36-year-old Millar hit .254 AVG/.365 OBP/.420 SLG, while the average major-league first baseman hit .276 AVG/.357 OBP/.463 SLG. Millar took his walks, but that's about all he did in 2007. Throw in the fact that he's a liability with the glove and on the bases, and you've got a player who would be best deployed as nothing more than a pinch-hitter against lefties.

Kevin Millar is actually the first base equivalent of Paul LoDuca minus the hankering for teenage girls. He is still living off his gritty, gamer personality and few good years with previous teams.

2B — Ray Durham, Giants
Durham was a very good player for a long time, and he put up excellent numbers as recently as 2006. Last season, however, he went over the statistical cliff, batting just .218 and getting on base at just a .295 clip. He's now 36, so a significant rebound seems unlikely. Fortunately for him, the miserable Giants don't have any other options.

Ray Durham did not add much nor did he take anything away with his 0.0 WARP1. There has to be someone out there who could help them out. A 0.1 WARP1 would represent an upgrade of infinity. INFINITY!!! Dare I say that Anderson Hernandez would be huge upgrade for them here?

3B — Rich Aurilia, Giants
Yes, Aurilia, at 36, is currently atop the Giants' pile — and it is a pile — at third base. Last season, Aurilia managed an OBP of barely better than .300, and since he's very much in his decline phase, there's no reason to expect improvement. These days, his bat won't play anywhere, particularly at a power position like third base.

Of course, I wanted him as a super sub. Not that I would have been wrong because maybe he might have done well in that role, we'll never know. However, he did have a really good season in 2006 after a pretty decent one in 2005 and not many could have predicted such a horrible decline. Ok, maybe many could have since Aurilla has been so up and down.

Just a side note here, if Wes Helms was still a starter, he would have won by a landslide.

SS — Omar Vizquel, Giants
Seriously, props to the Giants, without whom this column might not have been possible. Anyhow, Vizquel has a credible Hall of Fame case, but at this stage he has no business being a regular at the highest level. Defensively, he still makes the routine plays and the occasional highlight grab, but his range is now well below average. His offense is even worse than that. Vizquel will be 41 years old not long after Opening Day, so it's probably time to consider making graceful exit. On a broader level, it's challenging to impart just how bad the San Francisco

This all does beg the question, how does Brian Sabean even have a job much less get a two year extension? Please, do not tell me he was handcuffed by Barry Bonds. Bonds is no reason to decimate your ball club.

LF — Juan Pierre, Dodgers
As long as Pierre's in center field, he is mediocre enough to tolerate, but in left field, where the offensive bar is much higher, he's not adequate. He hits for average and runs the bases well, but when it comes to doing the two most important things a hitter can do — get on base and hit for power — he comes up woefully short, particularly by corner-outfielder standards.

If Juan Pierre sniffs any playing time this season, Joe Torre should be lambasted. The only reason he has any value whatsoever is because he steals a lot of bases. He literally adds nothing else to the equation. The key to making the playoffs is winning games, which should not be a big shock. With that in mind, Pierre in no way adds value over Ethier and Kemp.

CF — Mark Kotsay, Braves
Kotsay is injury prone, merely average defensively at this point, and last season, when healthy, wasn't able to hit a lick. Certainly he won't put up stats as grim as he did in 2007, when he flailed about to the tune of .214 AVG/.279 OBP/.296 SLG. However, you can improve upon those deliriously bad numbers and still not rise to the level of acceptability. The sooner top prospect Jordan Schafer is ready to take over in center, the better off the Braves will be. Of course, Schafer hasn't played a game above the Triple-A level, so they're likely stuck with Kotsay for the time being.

I do not like the Braves and it pleasures me to see someone who actually took wins away from their former employer lace up their cleats and put on a Braves uniform. You would have to go back to 2004 when he was 28 to see an above average season from him. That being said, the Braves did not make a bad move here. He might have one more league average year in him and it is not like they had a plethora of options.

RF — Mark Teahen, Royals
Teahen isn't a horrible player, and he's only 26. However, he makes it on this unfortunate list only because right field is a fairly deep position. Teahen had a good campaign in 2006, but last season he regressed, slugging just .410 and managing only one homer every 78 at-bats. That just doesn't cut it. He's young enough to reverse course, but he may not have the bat for such an "offense-first" position.

Out of this team that Perry compiled, Teahen would be the All-Star representative. He actually adds the most value out of any of the bunch and is legitimately league average. However, that .410 SLG% from a corner outfield spot is horrendous. Can he rebound? Possibly, but unlikely. His SLG% from the last three years is .376, .517, and .410. Which one does not belong? For those of you still trying to remain optimistic about him, his minor league SLG% is .421.

He will forever go down as the poster child for why you should always trade for the most talent rather than try and pigeon hole needs. Beltran for Wood, Teahen, and Buck? No esta bien.

Overall, it was a fun read. I do think Teahan was unfairly targeted and you could have certainly made a case for Johnny Damon and just made it three outfield spots in general rather than try and find someone for each spot. Damon posted a .396 SLG% at a corner outfield spot and to answer your question, only eight qualifying outfielders had a sub .400 SLG% in the bigs and the Yankees had two of them. Besides, Teahan is still only 26 while Damon is likely to continue to regress. Is David DeJesus still a starter? He could certainly qualify for a spot as well if so.

* * *

  • Good stuff.

  • Though not as good as above, still good stuff.

  • Good riddance Tom McCarthy.

  • Also from the above link..

    With arbitration hearings approaching, the Mets have yet to come to terms with two players: Oliver Perez and Ryan Church. GM Omar Minaya said Perez's agent, Scott Boras, is not interested in negotiating a contract that covers beyond the 2008 season, meaning Perez should be a free agent next winter. Perez has asked for $6.5 million, with the club countering at $4.725 million. Church, the newly acquired outfielder, requested $2.45 million, with the club offering $1.75 million. The Mets haven't gone to an arbitration hearing with a player since David Cone in 1992. ... Duaner Sanchez will have no limitations when pitchers and catchers report to Port St. Lucie next Thursday, according to Minaya.

    I guess this answers my question. However, I still think it is worth a shot. Really, $12 to $13 million is on the low side of what he would get. If he replicates 2007, he might receive $15 million per. As crazy as that sounds, it is entirely possible. My reasoning...

    1) The guy has good enough stuff to succeed in either league. There are some pitchers who AL teams want nothing of because they simply lack the ability to dominate with 'stuff'. Oliver has no such issues. He battles himself a lot, but should have no problem putting up great numbers in the AL when he is on which opens up the market a lot more.

    2) Carlos Silva. While Oliver is not an ace, he has front end potential. Carlos Silva does not and received a boatload of cash after Lilly, Meche, Marquis, and Suppan received rather handsome pay raises over the past few years. Basically, even Perez tosses up a 4.00 to 4.25 ERA, he will get paid. A four year deal for a guy on the right side of 30, throws with his left arm, throws in the low 90's, and is injury free is going to be a hot commodity and obviously Boras knows that. He would have to toss up a 5.00 ERA to really blow things up, which I cannot see happening.

    3) Who else is going to be out there? Best case scenario, there will be Sheets, CC, Smoltz, and Burnett.
    • Burnett may not have a great year and not opt out. Even if he does opt out, he will be looking for just as much or more money as Perez while being substantially older and carrying a huge injury risk.
    • As for Ben Sheets...see AJ Burnett. The same reasoning applies. A long term deal on Sheets is frightening.
    • Is there any chance Smoltz leaves?
    • If you are looking at CC and lose, you will certainly look at Perez. Overall, anyone looking to drop cash on a starter may look to Perez first being more affordable than CC and perhaps a better option than the other household names. Of course, CC might not even be changing addresses.
    Boras is not stupid and probably realizes this, which is why he is reluctant to deal now. However, ballplayers are always opining about security. A long term deal now would give him that on a team that is well positioned to win over the next five years.

    Maybe Omar can get a one on one a la A-Rod and the Yankees, but that seems doubtful. If Perez wanted to have a hand in this and was looking for something other than the best payday from any team regardless of long term outlook, he would have hired another agent.

  • Ben Johnson is back with the Mets. Great.

  • Freddie says "money ain't no thang". After the 20% price hikes, I should think not.

  • Also from the above link, Craig Wilson is drawing interest from the Mets. I have to say, I do like that idea. Pop off the bench is always nice and Wilson could certainly add that.

  • My how far Jeff has come. Although, we have no idea if all the other stuff we have heard in the past has been overblown, but it looks like the baseball people are in charge of baseball and the Wilpons are in charge of the money and making sure people are happy.

    Well....with the exception of Lastings. I still think they wanted him gone.

  • Legal or not, Pedro needs to stay out of the Rooster Coliseum. Nothing good can come of it and in the wake of Michael Vick fiasco, this will probably get a bit of press. Of course (right or wrong) chickens and dogs are on a different level and one was legal while the other was not, but whatever. Pedro should keep his distance and is still representing the Mets wherever he is.

  • A nice feel good article about Johan. It also came with this gem of a comment at the bottom.

    thegup Feb 7, 2008 8:14:26 AM
    You could give that idiot Willie 5 Santanas and he will find a way to mess things up. A fish rots from the head

    Good stuff.

  • Livan is out.

  • Sickels goes over the top prospects of 2000. Train wreck. It really puts a lot of things into perspective, but this one seems especially bad in terms of the talent translating into a top tier big league careers.
  • Labels: ,


    Blogger AE said...

    dayn perry is smoking crack.

    i could not get through this whole post without totally disputing the fact that he says omar vizquel's "range is now below average".

    after watching more than a few giants games last year, i can tell you that it has not diminished to below average. he still has greater range at short than our dominican wonderboy and current gold glover jimmy rollins. that's right i said it.

    vizquel is still better, defensively, at short than reyes and big mouth.

    don't get me wrong, overall - with the stick and with the speed - vizquel couldn't even qualify to carry reyes or rollins jocks. but that's something totally different.

    perry needs to actually watch some games before he says stuff like that. even the numbers support what i saw:

    Vizquel - 2007 FRAR 10
    Rollins - 2007 FRAR 8
    Reyes - 2007 FRAR 4

    wait....this is a mets related blog, right? sorry......

    10:27 AM

    Blogger Rickey Henderson said...

    Yay--no Livian! Rickey can breathe easy! And what in the name of fuck is Pedro doing at a cockfight? Can't he just watch Wright and Reyes wrestle nude in the Mets locker room instead?

    10:57 AM

    Blogger mr. met said...


    don't get me wrong, overall - with the stick and with the speed - vizquel couldn't even qualify to carry reyes or rollins jocks. but that's something totally different.

    I think that's the point. Vizquel was less valuable than Jack Wilson.

    That is not a very good thing.

    Can't he just watch Wright and Reyes wrestle nude in the Mets locker room instead?


    11:11 AM

    Anonymous benny blanco from da bronx said...

    Everytime the Giants are coming to town the stories and articles always come out about Vizquel "losing" it.
    And then the games take place and he amazes. He's nice man.

    Jason Kendall is only 33? Jesus, he's a very old 33.
    How did Rich Aurillia go from starting shortstop to BENCH player to getting a starting job back? What the hell! What team does he play for?
    Oh... ok, that explains it.

    Kevin Millar is actually the first base equivalent of Paul LoDuca minus the hankering for teenage girls.
    Atleast that we KNOW of.

    I hate Juan Pierre, to me, him and David Eckstein are exactly what is wrong with some GM's and journalism and the mass media.
    Juan Pierre steals bases but he gets caught enough to make him pointless. His career sucess rate is 74% WHOMPERS! His career high is 81% not good.

    Aww leave poor David DeJesus alone although he is just... a very BORING player. He has speed but when he runs he doesn't go anywhere. I dunno, he's just, BLAH!

    That commercial can't be real, can it? SOmeone would actually pay to put that on to promote thier store?
    I mean, its just soo bad. For a low fee I can help him with his commercial. Like 10 minutes of brainstorming will come up with a better premice for the commercial. And like... downloading a free video editer can help... alot. Renting something other than a camera phone would help as well. I think I'm going to take up a job as a director/producer for local shitty commercials.

    Craig Wilson was fairly succesfull off the bench for the Yankers. I've always been a fan of Wilson so I'm biased.

    That Jeffy Wilpon article was beautiful. It was like a coming of age story.

    No Cockfights in the Dominican Republic? C'mon, the economy is going to take a big hit!
    Maybe bullfighting in Spain is next on the list of things that should be banned.

    I must say, I was looking at the draft and top prospects from 2000, 2001, and 2002, and my god... disasters. I never heard of ANYONE! Not even Quadruple A guys in sight!

    11:14 AM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    Jason Kendall is done. I'm not even sure he is back-up quality these days. He got PAID though and does not have to worry about much anymore so he will not be sweating while looking for jobs.

    However, Bob Melvin picking him up speaks volumes about the lack of decent catching options out there. Nuts.

    I suspect Millar does like teenage girls, but innocent until proven guilty. I just cannot go around assuming these things.

    Leave DeJesus alone? He's tragic. Sorry. Another sub .400 SLG% guy.

    That commercial is 100% real. That guy was into it and local commercials on cable are usually horridly painful to watch. They make me uncomfortable they are so bad.

    Maybe bullfighting in Spain is next on the list of things that should be banned.

    Well, the bulls at least get their revenge during the running of the bulls, no?

    11:31 AM

    Anonymous ossy said...

    pierre was never really that good though he had some good seasons. he is more a product of good teams that feature sound fundamentals. that was the case in florida and in alot gm's imaginations since.

    now he can just ruin my most hated team.

    12:43 PM

    Anonymous ossy said...

    when i think of cock fighting i think of the movie that had the nun and a bunch of other people circled around 2 dudes swinging their wangs at each other. i cant remember the name though (police academy3?)

    12:44 PM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    Pierre = LoDuca with steals.

    Police Academy 3? I think I watched the first three, but that sounds like Police Academy 10 or something.

    12:59 PM

    Anonymous Danny said...

    Goldstein for BP came out with his Future Shock, Top 11 Mets Prospects:

    Five-Star Prospects
    Four-Star Prospects
    1. Fernando Martinez, OF
    Three-Star Prospects
    2. Jon Niese, LHP
    3. Eddie Kunz, RHP
    4. Wilmer Flores, SS
    5. Brant Rustich, RHP
    Two-Star Prospects
    6. Nathan Vineyard, LHP
    7. Scott Moviel, RHP
    8. Bobby Parnell, RHP
    9. Dan Murphy, 3B
    10. Ruben Tejada, SS/2B
    11. Stephen Clyne, RHP

    Just Missing: Nick Carr, RHP; Nick Evans, 1B; Francisco Pena, C

    Overall, he basically hates the system, although he allows that there are a lot of young players in the lower levels that have the potential to make The Leap. He really loves Flores before he's even had a professional at-bat, but hates Mike Carp (not even a mention). And Mike, there is still time to jump on the Ruben Tejada bandwagon that I have been trying to create!

    3:37 PM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    Good stuff. I hate Mike Carp as well for the record.

    Francisco Pena has fallen off of the radar as well.

    A lot of hatin' on Vineyard and Moviel putting them into the two-star bunch, but not all that much to go crazy about.

    We knew people would look down upon these guys and I cannot blame them. Not looking good!

    As for F-Mart, does he give out many Five-Star prospect status? I would imagine F-Mart would have been one or at the very least on the bubble. Unless that is solely for Jobas, Buccholz, Rasmus, Longoria, etc...

    4:03 PM

    Anonymous Danny said...

    Goldstein is one of the guys that is not particularly high on Fernando Martinez. He had him as the #51 overall prospect in the minor leagues.

    I disagree pretty strongly with him, but we'll see what Fernando! does this year.

    4:13 PM

    Blogger AE said...

    damn. juan pierre gets bashed like no tommorrow.

    for the record, i like juan pierre. he's one of by favorite players because he plays the game the right way (some people like eckstein because of this - i prefer pierre). he hustles on every play and gives it 100% everytime. he is never embroiled in controversy, is a good teammate, and is an all around class act. i also would like to think, if i was in the show, my skill set would be very similar to pierre's...but that's neither here nor there....

    now don't get me wrong - i don't think he's a great player by any stretch, but the man has some value to add to a team. he shouldn't have been given the contract he was given but he was - so whatever. so instead of focusing on that, i'll focus on his positives:

    1. he does not strikeout. he has more walks in his career than strikeouts. think about how many players can say that, not many. also he does not ground into all that many dp's even when he makes weak contact. he can also move a runner over with a sac bunt at will. if you need contact, he's your man.

    2. he is super durable. he has not missed a game since the 2002 season. he played 162 games in the seasons played from 2003-2007 - 5 straight years.

    3. excellent baserunner (regardless of benny's assessment - a 75% stealing rate is breakeven). anyway, by 1 baserunning stat (EqBRRate), Pierre is the 3rd best baserunner in the years 1956-2007.

    4. For the last 7 years he's averaged 4.2 WARP3. That's 4 wins above a replacement player which can't be all that bad.....

    Ok, so those are the positives. Would I want him starting on the Mets? No. Would I want him as a 4th OF? Maybe. Does his career line of .301/.348/.374 beat out Endy' line of .271/.311/.375 and Endy's superior defense? I'm not so sure....a team of Juan Pierre's batting would be worth 4.6 runs a game. A team of Endy's batting is worth 3.9 runs a game. Is the difference in their defense worth .7 runs? It's a tough question....

    Anyway, I like Juan Pierre for the simple reasons and root for him - whenever he's not playing the Mets.

    5:14 PM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    AE...I never questioned his heart. Just his skill. And I would not have a problem playing him if there were not TWO better options.

    Also, the debate is not about him being a 4th outfielder. He will be starting, which is the issue.

    Danny, F-Mart will show Goldstein a thing or two this year....I hope. If he fails, things will be looking bleak on the farm....or more bleak I should say.

    5:28 PM

    Anonymous benny said...

    Well, the bulls at least get their revenge during the running of the bulls, no?

    By 5pm, the Spanish people get the REAL revenge when they kill that chap.

    I am so immature I can't just have that immature grin when I keep reading about Pedro. Too many articles, comments, blogs about cock fighting and I think its official, I have the mentality of a 8 year old.

    Goldstein has Tabata and Austin Jackson ranked higher than Fernando Martinez. Why? Who knows.

    I like Nick Evans. He has really good power and he's only 21 years old. He gets no love and he did fairly well in AA if I'm not mistaken. Maybe this year he takes a step forward. Real under the radar guy, even I forgot about him.

    my skill set would be very similar to pierre's...
    You mean leading the entire major leagues in making outs?
    Sorry.. I had to do it.

    5:30 PM

    Anonymous DG said...

    As everyone here knows, I am a big Ollie Perez fan, but honestly,I don't really think it makes sense for Ollie, from his perspective, to talk an extension with the Mets. If I was his agent, I would not be rushing to get a deal done. If he puts up the same numbers as last year, I have no doubt that the Mets will make an effort to get him resigned, perhaps even deviating from past form and trying to talk extension during the season, but at worst, we still would gain two draft picks.

    6:04 PM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    The ugly side of the running of the bulls. I had no idea...that is not cool. Let them earn their freedom!!

    Oh yeah. I remember now. I wrote about that one. Eh, he is the lone soldier there. Voices of dissent are fine. It keeps people in check, no?

    No AA for Evans yet. Next season though, yes.

    DG...of course it doesn't!!! It only does if he does not trust himself. I am being selfish here, but hey, sometimes players extend. Shit, Peavy did and he is already an ace!!! I know his contract was not coming up, but guys do that stuff.

    The two draft picks would be a nice consolation for a team that direly needs them, but who pitches for them?

    6:17 PM

    Anonymous benny said...

    Damn so I AM mistaken... very embarassing. Still he's going to be a 22 year old in AA. 15 dingers in 103 games while playing the seaosn hurt, i'll take it as a positive.

    6:24 PM

    Anonymous ossy said...

    why the fuck do the yankees neeed to build a billion $$ stadium... so excessive. just another reason for jerkoff yankees fans to talk shit

    7:38 PM

    Blogger AE said...

    "my skill set would be very similar to pierre's...
    You mean leading the entire major leagues in making outs?
    Sorry.. I had to do it."

    that's a weak argument benny. you can do better!!!!! quantity of outs is a function of plate appearances. put someone like a-rod at the top of the lineup and he would lead the league in outs made too...

    and i do recall jose reyes leading the nl in making the most outs a few years ago...and who made the most outs last year?????????

    nl mvp jimmy rollins.

    put juan pierre, reyes, and rollins somewhere other than leading off and none of them lead the league in outs...

    8:19 PM

    Anonymous benny blanco from da bronx said...

    put someone like a-rod at the top of the lineup and he would lead the league in outs made too...
    Not when he's on base 40% of the time.

    Jimmy Rollins also hits more than one homerun per year.
    Jimmy Rollins and Jose Reyes created 139 and 110 runs respectively this past year.
    Juan Pierre had 84.

    Listen its ok to like him, I like a ton of players that people hate or don't think are any good but c'mon, lets be real here.

    8:44 PM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    AE and Kenny Lofton sitting in a tree....

    9:00 PM

    Anonymous benny said...

    You know what, I think that's a cool game, which player would you most be like?
    AE thinks he has the skill sets of Juan Pierre.
    And if I have to be perfectly honest, the type of player I would be if I was a major leaguer would probably be Rob Deer and Pete Incaviglia. Guys who hit for power and don't do ANYTHING else at all. Bad batting average a ton of strikeouts, and no patience.
    The most useless power hitters!
    Or maybe a Richard Hidalgo, just like the other guys, big power, but bad everything but a good fielder! I have a strong arm!
    Anyone else wanna play?

    9:41 PM

    Blogger Itsmetsforme said...

    i cant let a dawn perry mention go by without an ad hominum attack--perry doesn't need to watch the games, he's got stats. Jose A. Reyes. I'm out.

    10:29 PM

    Anonymous Two-By-Four said...

    The key to making the playoffs is winning games, which should not be a big shock.

    Education is an on going process no matter how many College Degrees one holds. Consider me enlightened.

    Perry's list should be stored and at the end of the season an award should be given to the player that exemplifies what that list is all about.

    Freddie says "money ain't no thang

    Okay, who kidnapped the Wilpons and replaced them with these pretenders?

    So that article about Martinez at the Cockfight was about Roosters. That reminds me of a great rooster joke.

    Benny’s mentioning of Bullfights brings up that classic joke about that so called sport.

    Juan Pierre reminds me of that joke about lucky Pierre. Anyway, anyone with two first names can’t be trusted. Reminds me of New York City Department of Parks and Recreation Commissioner Newbold Morris. The joke about his name went on to say "now Morris Newbold, that’s a name."

    Sickels’ list illustrates just how imprecise scouting and judging young talent in baseball really is when compared to other sports. Sometimes it's better to be lucky than good.

    If I may continue my useless post, Kevin Goldstein is a major Mets fan and sometimes he seems to bend over backwards not to praise any area of the Mets system. But I do fear he is correct in his present assessment.

    If I was a professional ballplayer pre-injury I would be like Steve Dalkowski and post injury my 3 year old nephew. :)

    11:32 PM

    Anonymous Anonymous said...

    can someone explain to me why you all agree that prospect class was a disaster? it doesn't seem so horrible to me. jake

    9:23 AM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    Jake...I just see no stars. Well, a few, but from a top 100? Please. Last year's top 100 has TONS O' STARS. Yes, they have not gotten a chance to fail per se, but a lot look veeeeery favorable.

    Benny, I play like Jacoby Ellsbury. Steal bases, hit for average, no pop, and can field. Though I had NO arm when I played a few years ago. So add on Juan Pierre's arm and that's me.

    9:40 AM

    Blogger mr. met said...

    2x4, his assessment about what? Fernando or the entire system? I'd agree on the entire system...

    9:41 AM

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